Bucky mentally preparing himself for death is so fucking upsetting because after all of the torture he went through, after all of the physical and mental pain, he survived because Steve saved him, and here he is ready to die for him. He lets himself have this moment of fear because he knows what’s coming, he knows that he’s going to die and he allows himself to accept how scared he really is. He knew what he was getting in to when he made the choice to fight side by side with Steve (because what other choice was there really?), and part of him probably always knew this was how it would end – he was either going to live for Steve or die for him, the only thing left for him to do was to acknowledge his unhappy ending when the time came.
FRIENDLY REMINDER THAT POSITIONING BUCKY’S SACRIFICE AS HIS CHOICE MEANS THAT IT WAS THE LAST TIME HE EVER GOT TO EXERCISE HIS OWN FREE WILL.
But this is actually really important, though, looking through a biopolitical lens, because in fact that choice (his choice to sacrifice himself, to die) got taken away from him. His “resurrection” as the Winter Soldier is a denial of his right to die, his right to decide what to do with his life, his body. That type of control is a horror that we tend to think of as a horror above or beyond death; there is something worse than death, and it is losing what we think of as the basic embodied human right of inhabitation of, autonomy over one’s own body. That’s what he’s about to suffer, and it kind of turns this scene from tragedy into horror story.
Holy shit just.
This has been sitting on the edge of my consciousness for a while now and it’s so truly horrible.
And it parallels with Steve (although never as bad, Bucky is everything that could have gone wrong and did go wrong and Steve is everything that could have gone wrong and somehow went almost right) because the same thing happened to Steve, he put himself in the water, he died to save the world and then the world brought him back and he got to see that his sacrifice meant nothing and it’s no fucking wonder he was so willing to let Bucky kill him on the helicarrier he realised too well that you can fight the good fight but the FIGHT NEVER ENDS and Steve is just. so. tired.
I have been trying to put this into words for a while now. Ty.
Give me all the respectable middle class Bucky and his poor fatherless Irish Catholic pal. Give me Mrs. Barnes worrying about her boy taking up with the wrong sort. Give me Bucky working as a clerk for a shipping firm and complaining vehemently when he has to actually go down…
CATFA tried to pack the backstories for Howard, Peggy, Bucky, Zola, and Steve into one fucking movie, along with the whole Red Skull thing and they just ended up going nowhere. The Howling Commandos alone are worth an entire two hour film (it’s called Inglorious Basterds. I am in denial), and instead we get a montage.
Okay so the short version is the first one would be every prewar stucky fic ever and the second one would be Inglorious Basterds.
The long version is this. Here you go drop-deaddream, you asked for it.
i always forget how much i hate the ‘lock bucky in a cell and remove his arm for his own good’ trope until i stumble onto it again. for a movie that’s pretty much all about the importance of agency, it’s astounding how many fics involve tearing that agency away from the winter soldier as a precursor to bucky’s recovery
“Removing Bucky’s arm” is my #1 MCU!fandom pet peeve too, and here’s why:
I’m guessing this trope is partially inspired by the comics, in which Tony Stark did imprison Bucky on board S.H.I.E.L.D.’s helicarrier and removed his cybernetic arm to 1) incapacitate him, and 2) allow S.H.I.E.L.D.’s scientists the opportunity to study it further.
Of course, this plan backfired spectacularly when Bucky’s arm turned out to be independently functional, staged an escape, and reunited with Bucky—who then used it to beat the crap out of Tony (not undeservedly).
In the comics, Bucky turned his loss of bodily autonomy to his own advantage: like a Trojan horse, his opponents thought he was weak without his primary weapon and let their guards down, taking him exactly where he wanted to be. Bucky then freed himself, fought Tony to a draw, and proved beyond a doubt that he was the right person pick up Steve’s shield and uniform after Steve’s death. Rather than disabling him, removing Bucky’s arm enabled him to achieve his main goal—and demonstrated his ultimate badassery to the audience.
However, when Bucky’s arm is removed in the MCU fandom, his loss of autonomy is never* (*that I can recall seeing) turned into an opportunity for self-empowerment. The decision of having the arm returned to him always rests firmly with others, mainly Steve, and hinges on Bucky’s compliance—only when he is deemed sufficiently “recovered” or “harmless” (or when Steve is in trouble and the Avengers need Bucky to save him) is he allowed to have his arm back. Often this is combined with some form of upgrade rendering the arm lighter (and often more fragile) or removing tracking/self-destruct devices from it, again making Bucky dependent on others for his safety and/or comfort. This is problematic (sorry!) because, as OP says, it robs Bucky of agency—he and his arm are objects acted upon by others rather than subjects acting upon their environment themselves. Rather than an opportunity to show off Bucky’s badass super-assassin skills like in the comics, the loss of his arm is used to put him in a position of weakness and make the audience pity him.
(I also feel sorry for Tony, to be honest, because in 98% of MCU!Steve/Bucky fanfics where he makes an appearance, his sole purpose is to remove/upgrade/replace Bucky’s cybernetic arm, shoe-horning him into the role of “the mechanic” as if that’s all he can contribute to Bucky’s recovery. Remember, Tony also had a cybernetic body part (the arc reactor) installed without his consent, came to terms with it and other people’s reactions to it (Pepper through it was disgusting and made faces when she touched it in Iron Man 1), and eventually turned it to his own advantage: it almost killed him a couple of times, but ultimately he used it to save the world. I think Bucky would benefit more from hearing Tony’s story than from any upgrade of his arm Tony could provide.)
((I’ll also add the usual caveat that fanfic authors are of course allowed to write anything they want, period—if you want to remove Bucky’s arm for plot or hurt/comfort reasons (yes plz!), or because you’re a meanie (hello, HTP!), no one’s stopping you! Just take a moment, as all conscientious authors do, to reflect on why you choose to do so and be aware of the wider implications.)) 🙂
That second gif, for just a moment he looks so relieved. It’ll be over. His war will be over. And that last one is just driving it home. He’s done. He’s ready for whatever is next.
you should totally rewatch the first movie and pay close attention to what Steve’s face does. Or doesn’t do. Because Steve is not a puppy dog, Steve does not wear his heart on his sleeve, Steve is still and steady and tries so very hard not to be easy to read because Steve’s life is pain he cannot share for fear of having his personhood literally revoked. Steve is stand-offish. Steve sees that you’re angry with him and flatly makes light of what he’s doing that’s pissing you off. Steve will give one-word answers to shut you down. Steve doesn’t meet your eyes until he’s finished speaking. Steve rarely smiles and when he does, they’re rarely bright—they’re small and mostly in the crinkle of his eyes and god forbid you make him smile when you’re arguing with him because then they’re sharp and bitter just like his laughter.
Steve Rogers starts fights. Steve Rogers lies to your face. Steve Rogers stands as straight as he can with his crooked spine because he refuses to let you assume he can’t. Steve Rogers is not a golden retriever, he is a sickly, pissy little cat who will bite the shit out of you for trying to pet him.
If you’re following me and you don’t know it by now — though I have no idea how you possibly could have missed it — I have an announcement: I really like Steve Rogers. I like Steve because he’s a great character, and it is much to my disappointment to find the fandom applying things to his character that I think are sometimes the opposite of what the evidence would suggest.
Of course with something like Marvel when there are so many different canons, it’s definitely hard to pinpoint one thing as always right or always wrong. Thus, I will focus on movieverse considering it is what I am most familiar with, as I assume you all are as well.
A lot of these things have basically wormed their way (undeservedly, I believe) into fanon, or what is so widely spread considered canon by the fandom that it is a near irrefutable fact when discussing it with another fan. Hopefully by the end you’ll understand why I feel this way.
For each point I will state my feeling on the subject, why I understand people interpret differently and then explain my own reasoning behind it. My intent is not to get into an argument or upset anyone; this is my opinion. However I think that a lot of these things have some people coming to the conclusion that Steve Rogers is a boring character, and I hope to disabuse that as much as possible.
Steve Rogers is not technologically challenged. A lot of this leans on his comment to Tony on the Helicarrier during The Avengers that “It seems to run on some form of electricity!” A remark that has been interpreted as this is the only thing he can figure out. But look at that in context; Steve is quite literally talking to a tech genius at the time. Despite never having been on the Helicarrier (as far as we know), Tony is able to assess the damage and prioritize what they should do in order to avoid plunging to their deaths.
It’s hardly that Steve is stupid, Tony is just really ridiculously knowledgeable about this subject. When Tony, in the heat of the moment, forgets that not everyone on earth can look at an unfamiliar piece of tech and relay whether or not it’s still working and what it says about the rest of the machinery, Steve makes a sarcastic comment to remind him that he’s going to need a little more to go on in order to help.
Later in the same scene we see Steve pushing the panel back in, implying that in that space of time, he has figured it out and shared his findings with Tony. His other tech related remark in that scene of “Speak English!” is likely him trying to save time; the big explanation of why he needs to do whatever it is being not nearly as imperative as him knowing what needs to be done.
The other thing to keep in mind is that this is fitting with what we see of his character in Captain America, where he is working closely with Howard Stark — who is represented in the movies as being just as intelligent as his son — and also taking down Hydra, who has technology that nobody has seen before. He gets a tricked out motorcycle, understands how the vibranium shield could be more useful than any of the other designs Howard has come up with, and takes control of several different kinds of aircraft that he can hardly have been expected to have been given a class on how to fly.
Compared to Tony Stark, is Steve a technological idiot? Sure. Then again, so is everybody else.
Neither is he a blushing, virginal innocent. Fondue. We’ve all laughed about it, about how awkward he is to the point that he can’t even say something like “sleep together” or “are you seeing each other”. However, Springhole.net’s Tips and Notes for Writing Steve Rogers has an interesting take on this:
When Steve heard Howard Stark use the term “Fondue,” he immediately assumed it was a euphemism for an intimate activity. In other words, upon hearing an unfamiliar word his mind went straight to the gutter.
And considering the very clear tilde when Howard asks Peggy if she wants to stop for a “late night fondue~”, he can hardly be blamed in the least.
Combining this with the fact that he traveled (likely for at least a month or two) with a bunch of showgirls in short skirts and plunging necklines and that he was lifelong friends with Bucky Barnes — implied to be quite the ladies’ man — of all people, I’m fairly certain he has no trouble understanding a dirty joke or double entendre.
Especially when one considers essentially the only other dialogue we hear from the candidates at Camp Leheigh is a proposition to Peggy, it can easily be assumed that the language in the barracks wasn’t exactly something you’d want your mother to hear. And as great as the Howling Commandos are, I doubt they’re above bragging over an exploit or two.
Does this mean Steve is not a virgin? No. He very well could be and there’s no issue with that characterization decision based on the information we know.
However we do know that when Peggy came out dressed to the nines, he most definitely gave her a look over that had nothing to do with her great personality.
He isn’t above breaking the rules. Steve disobeys direct orders on several occasions, even when it is absolutely and utterly stupid — such as singlehandedly trying to rescue several hundred soldiers from enemy territory.
He likely would have attempted to figure out SHIELD’s intentions with the Tesserect earlier on, but was without the context that would have let him know that it was suspicious. Once given it, he breaks into a storage unit. Even if it was Fury’s hope that the team would pull together, it was still against orders that he stole a quinjet with two other Agents and took control of the situation happening in the city.
Steve is insubordinate, occasionally arrogant and likely quite irritating to his superiors when he decides to go off and do his own thing.
But then again; he never was supposed to be a perfect soldier.
Being called Captain America does not mean Steve is American patriotism personified. The name he was given that sticks was a publicity stunt to sell war bonds. ‘Captain America’ is propaganda. Something that he doesn’t seem to enjoy. Yes, it is what he calls himself when rescuing the 107th, but what else does he have to say? Not to mention the fact that it was likely another example of his very prevalent dry sense of humor.
We see Captain America comic books being read by soldiers, and at least some of them had probably heard of the latest moral boost in the form of a soldier in red, white, and blue. In my opinion, he was mainly being a bit of a troll. Later, it’s Bucky who calls for recognition for “Captain America” instead of Steve Rogers.
Even further on when he is regularly in combat, the news reels are using him as an icon rather than a person.
When Coulson mentions he’s had some design input on the uniform, Steve seems almost reluctant to step back into that role. It’s also interesting to note that his uniform in The Avengers is quite a bit less utilitarian seeming than the one in Captain America, and is in a lot of ways reminiscent of the one he wears with the USO when selling bonds — implying that he is once again being used as a form of propaganda as “Captain America”.
As a last point for this, I’d like to mention what he says upon his first meeting with Doctor Erskine: “I don’t like bullies. I don’t care where they’re from.” [emphasis added]
Steve isn’t a Nazi-hating American. He’s a guy who doesn’t like seeing other people taking unfair advantage of others. In fact, the focus of his team’s efforts aren’t even with the rest of the American army, they’re off doing something completely different because that’s where they believe the biggest threat to everyone is, not just the biggest threat to the USA.
If he doesn’t care where the enemy is from, why should it matter what country he was born in?
Steve has a temper. This is something I often see completely ignored, making him a placid, mild character that is the only thing keeping the rest of the volatile personalities of the team together. But one of the first things we ever see of his personality in Captain America is him getting into a fight over some yelled comments in a movie theater. Is he correct to find those comments tasteless? Absolutely. However he does let them get to him a little more than is probably wise, and based on his conversation in the car with Peggy a little later on in the movie; this apparently happens a lot.
Then, when Erskine is killed, his first reaction after disbelief and sadness is something bordering on rage. Upon waking up at SHIELD in the 21st century, he is irritated and almost threatening when the agent attempts to tell him that he is still in the forties when he knows otherwise, and then proceeds to throw her backup through the walls.
His initial appearance in The Avengers has him coping with the stress of war in addition to having lost everything he had and loved. By punching things. Usually this scene is focused on because of the great butt shot and the fact that he’s wearing a shirt that hugs him in a way I only wish I could, and skips over the fact that he is apparently so used to breaking the equipment that he has extras lined up waiting, and then takes one home with him to continue taking his frustrations out on innocent punching bags there.
When goaded by Tony, he doesn’t even attempt to talk it out before they’re trading snarky jabs and Steve soon very clearly states he wouldn’t mind it in the least if they got physical. Essentially, he gets into an argument and has no trouble at all going from there to wanting to duke it out.
I’m not saying he has an anger issue because I don’t believe he does. However it says a lot about his character that he would prefer to end a dispute by “Go[ing] a few rounds”.
Yes, I think he draws the team together, but it isn’t out of a lack of impulsiveness on his part.
Whenever I see someone complaining about Steve as a character, it’s because they think he’s boring as the straight-laced good guy. The problem with this is the assumption that in order to be a good man, you can’t have vices or shortcomings, and because he has a firm moral center he must be a flat character.
Steve Rogers is a good man. But he’s also a man who would rather settle things with his fists when he gets riled up, and his first inclination after the death of a dear friend is an attempt to get plastered. He isn’t the mindless soldier who always does what he’s told, and he’s not a bumbling idiot who can’t navigate his way around the subway or cellphones.
When you force Steve into a variety of stereotypes he doesn’t deserve based on what I believe are faulty interpretations of what we know of him, you yourself are simplifying a complex character and sacrificing a lot of interesting opportunities for exploration of that character. It can definitely be humorous to write him struggling with technology, but it flattens him into a trope instead of building the character.
Essentially; if you think Steve Rogers is boring, it’s only because you’ve made him that way.
No, but you don’t understand why I liked Iron Man 3 so much.
In all the other Avengers movies, we see characters going through pain and trauma and heartache. We see Steve lose practically his whole world and still carry on. We watch Bruce struggle with trying to figure out just how the Hulk fits into his life and his psyche; it is implied that he deals with depression and tries to end his life. We hear Clint and Natasha and their angst about the “red in their ledgers”, the things they have done, and we watch as Thor essentially comes of age and deals with the pain of having his brother fall down deeper and deeper. We KNOW the pain and the issues and the upset are there.
But Iron Man 3 is the first time we actually get to witness—REALLY witness—the aftermath of heroics.
In the first part of the movie we see Tony Stark dealing with real, honest-to-god PTSD. He has panic attacks, he can’t sleep, he gets reckless and has a harder time taking care of himself, he obsessively spends hours working on suits so he can protect Pepper—even though in doing so he is unintentionally threatening their relationship. Rarely has such a thorough job been done in showing that all the flash-bang-let’s-save-the-world action would, in real life, have some serious psychological consequences.
Then, as the film progresses, we see him laid low. REALLY low—we see him get taken apart piece by piece. He loses his home, he loses contact with the people he cares about, he loses his suit—which means, in the context of the past few films, that he is in some ways dead. “He is Iron Man”, after all, isn’t he? The public sees him as one with the suit, and in a sense, so does he—a good deal of his self esteem, his sense of being able to defend people, is locked up in what he can do in the suit. And now he’s stranded in the middle of nowhere—he can’t fly, he can’t fight much, he’s still suffering from PTSD, he’s being actively hunted by the few people who don’t think he’s dead. All of his real ability is locked up in his brain, a place not everyone would think to look. We see him almost completely broken down.
And then we watch him build himself back up again, but with one major difference: he does it without the suit.
In most of the second half of the film, in almost all of his major victories, Tony is not in the suit. He breaks into Killian’s mansion essentially with odds and ends he’s cobbled together. He saves the passengers from Air Force One with a suit he’s remotely controlling. He wins the final battle with a whole bunch of suits that he is not in at all. Rhodes saves the president, and Pepper kills the villain. Not Tony. And at the end of the day he blows up all the suits and tosses his mini arc reactor into the ocean.
Iron Man 3 is brilliant and underrated precisely because it lets the hero be a real man—a man, not a man in a suit. A person who can still work wonders even when he’s at his very lowest, when he’s stranded and battling mental illness. Someone who can’t operate completely alone, who lets other people have some victories as well—heck, who needs his friends and teammates to win. And as he says at the end of the movie, while he may not always wear a suit, he will always be Iron Man.
And personally, I think that is an A-freaking-plus storyline to bring into this franchise.
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